On cavity wall insulation
Jeff Howell, the Sunday Telegraph’s resident builder with an attitude problem, writes this week on the vexed subject of cavity wall insulation. Jeff is firmly in the non-believer camp: he reckons that cavities, if built empty, should be left empty because the original intention behind a cavity was to stop water penetrating from the external brick cladding through to the house. Well, that is what the cavity wall designers would have us believe.But my researches tell me that the reason for the widespread adoption of the cavity wall design in the 1920s and 30s was nothing to do with builders wanting to improve construction standards. No, it was down to cost and speed. It was (and remains) much quicker and cheaper to build a single skin of brickwork separated by a cavity from a single skin of blockwork, than to build a double thickness brick-only wall, the way Victorians and Edwardians built brick houses. In today’s money, it costs around £50 per m2 to build a single skin of brickwork, about £20 per m2 to build a block wall, thus around £70 per m2 to combine the two around a cavity. In comparison, a solid double-skin brick wall is going to cost close to double a single skin one, i.e. £100 per m2. It’s a no-brainer. If you were a 1930s housebuilder, you would switch to cavity walls, and tell your customers you were doing it for their benefit.
What’s remarkable about the whole cavity wall story is just how useless the cavity has been. It’s only marginally better at keeping rain out of a house than solid brickwork. It seems to make little difference whether it gets filled with insulation or not. Wider cavities perform better than narrower ones and failure rates are highest where the rain falls the most: neither of these facts will startle you.
The question, which exercises Jeff so much, is whether you should or shouldn’t inject insulation into an empty cavity. The government is all in favour as it’s one simple and cost effective way of reducing carbon emissions. And there are tempting grants available for you to do this. Check out the Energy Savings Trust website . Jeff reckons it causes problems elsewhere, specifically making damp penetration problems more likely. His evidence is sketchy at best: he claims that he gets a bulging postbag when he writes on the subject from people who have suffered penetrating damp and condensation problems since having their cavities injected.
Jeff has a more specific beef than just compromising the cavity. He reckons that cavity wall installers’ favourite material is mineral wool because it’s cheap and it’s very quick to blow in. In fact, he writes that gangs can do five houses a day. And he also claims that the job is often rather poorly carried out. At five houses a day, I can quite believe that. This leads to a problem with voids, where they have missed bits of the cavity out, and slumping, where the mineral wool fails to hold its position. Both these will lead to cold spots. In fact work by Kingspan, the Irish insulation manufacturer, supports these claims. They have undertaken various thermographic studies that highlight the prevalence of cold spots inside cavities.
Now Jeff reckons that these cold spots are likely to cause condensation inside the house. I think he’s wrong. He writes because the house is now better insulated, the internal temperature can rise and with it, relative humidity. This means wall areas that are slightly cooler than the rest can be subject to condensation and black mould, which can give the impression of penetrating dampness.
Now why do I think his analysis is wrong? Because he doesn’t seem to know how or why condensation forms. Condensation requires temperatures to fall below a dew point: in most modern homes, that dew point is around 12°C. It varies with the relative humidity levels but in most homes in winter the internal temperature is kept at around 20°C and the relative humidity sits at between 50% and 60%. This air: moisture mix hits its dew point at 12°C. Now increasing the temperature doesn’t of itself increase relative humidity: in fact, without adding more moisture, it does the reverse. It certainly doesn’t affect the dew point temperature. If you leave a room unheated and the temperature falls below 12°C, you will find condensation forming on the coldest surface, which is often the window. If there is a cold spot in the wall, maybe where the cavity wall installers have missed a bit, then, yes, there is every chance that condensation will form next to it. But it is not the cavity wall insulation that is causing the problem, it’s the low internal temperature. In fact, cavity wall insulation should improve the situation because the room temperature will stay higher for longer, because the heat loss characteristics of the room have been improved.
So what’s my advice regarding cavity wall insulation? I say, go for it. If the installers reckon it’s OK, then I really can’t see what the problem is. And if it’s not installed perfectly, it is still better than nothing. But I do agree with Jeff on one thing. I think mineral wool is the worst option for this work: I’d go for polystyrene beads, everytime.


37 Comments:
Thoughtful advice which I found Helpful
Jeff Howell was spot on when he said that cavities should be left clear to provide good ventilation.
Many older properties were built without vertical damp proof courses (VDPC) around windows and doorways because with adequate cavity ventilation it was unnecessary. Obviously when the cavity is filled with mineral fibre this is no longer the case.
The presence of mineral fibre also causes an increase in temperature differential across the cavity which results in condensation on the inside of the outside wall which in turn can lead dampness on the inside walls (without water penetration from outside).
From personal experience I can confirm that injecting mineral fibre into the cavity of properties which do not have VDPCs around the windows and doorways will result in dampness and ruined plaster within 10 years as dampness slowly migrates through the brickwork around the windows and doorways to the inside walls. In my case the manufactures guarantee was worthless because they claimed that the mineral fibre does not absorb water by capillary. They also refused to accept any responsibility for the failure to ensure that the property was suitable for mineral fibre insulation before it was installed and I am now left with a bill for approx. £3500 to rectify the problem.
I am considering seeking compensation through the courts but high legal costs may make action uneconomic. I guess that the manufacturer who issued the guarantee is well aware of this.
Am interested to find out how RHD got problem rectified. I have been writing to CIGA since 2005 and they have not yet come to look at the black mould which I have got not only around the window frames and all over the bathroom walls but also now in the bedrooms! I just want it rectrified but no builders will take the job on!
I had cavity walll insulation installed about 5 years ago. After seeing mould and a damp patch on the outside wall I found I had a leaking header tank valve. Which was discharging during the night when the water was at it's highest pressure.
It's a big insurance claim, new kitchen, bathroom tiling plastering a carpet and decorating.
Whilst the cause was the header tank valve, if there was no cavity insulation, or the cavity insulation had been without voids the damage would of been far less.
Voids in the insulation not only create cold spots but also allow the water to track over the cavity
to the inside wall. No voids and there is a barrier against damp.
I got a friend with an endascope camera to look inside my cavities and there are not only voids but several areas where there is no insulation whatsoever, just a hole where it was supposed to have been installed.
My advice "If you do get cavity wall insulation installed, make sure the installer uses a thermal imaging camera to check for cold spots". Soon every home will need to have an eco survey before it can be sold.
I wonder how many homes will be like mine, after having it installed free on a British Gas grant.
Hi, have been following the debate on cavity wall insulation with some interest. Have recently had mine done (mineral fibre); no obvious problems but in one room a new 'mouldy' smell has appeared and cannot trace the source of this.
Now suspect problem area might be windows and unseen damp from penetration between wall and brick.
No real signs of any damp though.
My questions. If you replace windows can you fit these vertical damp proof courses before installing new frames? I am thinking of replacing windows. Also was planning to replace with double glazed wooden frames. Might it then be better to replace with UVPC?
Would appreciate any advice.Many thanks.
My problem was rectified by breaking out brickwork from around the windows and installing a VDPC. This appears to have been successful. Another but more costly alternative would have been to remove all Rockwool insulation from the cavities.
I would recommend that any problems are investigated by a qualified chartered surveyor (FRICS) before deciding on the best course of action. Builders would be more likely to tackle the problem if they were to act on the instructions of a suitably qualified surveyor.
I have found that installers suppliers and the BBA all support each other in denying that there are problems even when the evidence is overwhelming, therefore obtaining compensation is difficult. I have not given up and I am currently being assisted by my MP.
Unfortunately, my cavities were insulated before cover by an insurance backed guarantee became the norm. I would recommend free advice from Trading Standards if the supplier of an insurance backed guarantee did not provide the cover which they had been paid for.
Using polystyrene beads is fine until you want to do an alteration.
Even puting in a new extactor fan can cause a huge quantity of the beads to come cascading out leaving a large triangle section of the wall above the fan empty and the room flooded with beads.
Anyone who thinks that CIGA will cover repair costs resulting from cavity insulation; read on:
ANSWER
Sorry - I don’t recognise or agree with the conclusion drawn in the example. Plaster perishes around windows with and without CWI, through condensate or perhaps water penetration at the reveals. The condensate can be driven by any cold bridge such as the masonry, window, window frame etc. Lifestyle and property maintenance have an influence on the promulgation of the concern.
For the most part, cavity ventilation and vertical dpc’s are red herrings.
The Guarantee is against defect in workmanship or materials - but cannot underpin the performance of the building, since this is driven by a large number of factors outside of the influence of the CWI and installing firm.
Peter Dicks
Technical Director
Cavity Insulation Guarantee Agency
01525 853300
07973 211756
Sent: 26 October 2007 15:34
To: Peter Dicks
Subject: RE: Dampness Problems
QUESTION
I know of a case where mineral fibre was installed in a 1930s house and after about 8 years plaster started crumbling around the windows.
The cause of the problem was found to be lack of ventilation in the cavity. The house had a normal cavity wall and a normal horzontal damp proof course to stop rising damp. The structure was well maintained and in good condition.
However there was no vertical damp proof course around the windows because at the time of construction this was not mandatory. With good cavity ventilation this was not a problem but after the cavity insulation was installed this essential ventilation was lost and dampness crossed to the inner wall at the window reveals.
The problem was checked by a qualified surveyor and he found no faults other than a lack of cavity ventilation. The lack of VDPC was not consierdered to be a defect because it was in line the original design of the property and and not unusual in houses built around the 1930s.
The insulation supplier (who issued the guarantee) said that the problem was not due to a failure of the insulation and would not payout under the life of property guarantee.
My question is How would CIGA treat a problem of this type?
We find your advice very interesting and helpful. We are thinking of having cavity wall insulation in our bungalow. We have condensation evidence at each corner of the bungalow and using dehumidifers to help the problem. We do not have air vents. We are not sure if there was originally and they have been taken away. Do you advise putting air vents before having cavity wall insulation or go ahead without them?
Can anybody help me. We have moved into a ground floor appartment(block of 2)there is no dampness. But I found a mould forming on clothes in the storage drawers under the bed in both bedrooms. We have an ensuite in 1 bedroom. We have installed a dehumidifer in the bedroom with the ensuite. Should we go for cavity wall insulation. The problem occurred in Sept. after the damp summer, and no heating on. We have not been in the property for a year yet.
Polystyrene in contact with PVC (ie the electrical wiring) makes the PVC go brittle?!?
I know I have some sockets in my 1950's bungalow wired in by dropping the PVC ring main down the cavity.
Harry
Surely the original artical on this page is wrong in saying relative humidity will not increase with temperature unless you add more moisture. You will be adding moisture by living - use a dehumidifier to see how much - and warm air can hold more moisture than colder air. The moisture will hang round the coolest parts, usually where furniture reduces air circulation, and help mould grow.
my house is 17years old and we have just recently had the garage made into another room there is a room above the garage and both rooms are realy cold my father in law said we cant get cavity wall insulation because we have got insulation in the wall already but my question is how come them two rooms are so cold and if we could get cavity wall insulation do u think it would be benificial to us if not is there another insulation we could benefit from.
We are considering CWI because of alterations being carried out and building control have specified it. However what puzzles me is that claims are made that 35% of heat loss is through the walls but how can that be - when heat rises? I am personally convinced of the benefits of roof insulation but do wonder about CWI.
VENTILATION, VENTILATION, VENTILATION.
I have worked on many properties over the years (new and listed) and the biggest problem that I have seen is lack of ventilation. Installing CWI takes away ventilation in your house and you need to provide an alternative route to release the moisture build up in the air. If you can rule out external water egress (rain penetration, leaking pipe etc.)then the mould and dampness within rooms and around windows is nearly always due to the lack of ventilation. The easiest solution is to open a window at least once a day to change the air (or after a shower/ bath / washing etc.) The next best is to install an extract fan. Building Control do not insist on trickle ventilators and extract fans to new houses for fun! CWI has sealed your house by wrapping a blanket around it. VENTILATE YOUR HOME. Who knows, it may even smell a bit better.
I had CWI installed at the same time as a new condensing boiler, and since then a damp patch has appeared on the outside wall at the DPC level, but only in 2 or 3 places around the house. This patch then spreads from the DPC towards the ground but almost dries before it reaches there. At DPC level the patch is about 1 metre wide, but gradually reduces to about 30 cm just at soil level, so the water is going down not up. I have had the plumbing, central heating and drains checked but they are all ok. Could this be due to a complete absence of airbricks for ventilation, or has anyone any ideas please?
My question is,Do I need CWI or not,I can get this done free because I am 81 but I have always had doubts about it.My friend who is a builder of long standing,will not entertain it because of ensuing damp problems.I have no damp in my bungalow at present so I am loath to have this done in case dampness is caused.
Are Housing Association landlords responsible for installing CWI at all? If not, how would this be dealt with re costs when I am the middle tenant? Does CWI reduce noise disturbance and if not,can anyone recommend soundproofing materials for a low income lady but not on benefits please. Thanks
Why is everyone obsessed with damp being caused by mineral fibre insulation? If you already have a problem with damp, it COULD make it worse. It's down to you, not the intaller, to get this sorted first. If you have no probs at time of installation, it is true that CWI can help to prevent damp. All these people who have "spoken to a mate who's a builder" drive me mad! You need to talk to an installation company (I work for one) before making a decision.
Cavity wall insulation causes an increase in condensation within the cavity and prevents natural ventilation within the cavity. The cavities are designed to be ventilated. If you prevent the cavity from performing its function as designed you take a risk to and the consequences cannot be blamed on the building.
Any installer will tell you that cavity wall insulation does not cause dampness and will claim that the installation is fully guaranteed. However, if you have a problem and try to make a claim then thed installer and CIGA will both say that you are not covered because the problem is due to faults in the house - funny these faults were not evident before the CWI went in. I speak from experience.
Cavity wall insulation causes an increase in condensation within the cavity and prevents natural ventilation within the cavity. The cavities are designed to be ventilated. If you prevent the cavity from performing its function as designed you take a risk and the consequences cannot be blamed on the building, it is a result of obstructing a design feature.
Note
The supplier should ensure that the building is suitable before the CWI installed.
Any installer will tell you that cavity wall insulation does not cause dampness and will claim that the installation is fully guaranteed. However, if you have a problem and try to make a claim then it is a different storey. The installer and CIGA will both say that you are not covered because the problem is due to faults in the house - funny these faults were not evident at the time of survey before the CWI went in. I speak from experience.
I have seen small plastic vents in between the bricks in some new buildings. Could these solve a dampness/airflow problem?
In new houses the cavity is only partially filled and there is an air gap between the outer wall and the insulation. This is to ensure that the cavity condensation which forms on the outer wall does not saturate the insulation. The plastic drain vents below the DPC level are provided so that the condensation is drained to the outside and cannot collect in the bottom of the cavity.
In a fully filled cavity these drains will not provide ventilation because air movement is prevented by the insulation.
Whether or not retrofit cavity insulation will cause dampness is dependant upon the quality of the survey prior to installaion. Note: The installer will not look very hard for reasons to not install. In the case of a pre 1950 house the survey should be carried out by an independant chartered surveyor.
The CWI people came today and filled the cavities. I am grateful for the recent advice on the damp problem. The Technical Manager of the company said that if empty spots occur then the outer skin of the cavity wall will remain much colder than the filled areas, and that some condensation will occur at this cold spot on the outer skin. The water will seep down the outer skin and appear at DPC level.
I will monitor the patches and keep you informed.
Didz
My father has been trying to persuade me to have my have house CWId. I have been loathe to do so, mostly because in Devon, 3ft-thick walls do not prevent damp. We built our house and I remember the architect being very hot with the builders about pug being knocked off the wall ties. I have no damp problems, our windows are mahogany and in perfect condition after 20 yrs. At the time of building, we installed double insulation in the loft. My heating bills seem fair-to-good when comparing my house with others. Having spent 10 minutes reading this website, I'm NOT going to have it installed and hopefully all discussions can cease! Very many thanks to you all.
Jane C
PS - Solar panels being installed next month - we are doing our bit!
My father has been trying to persuade me to have my have house CWId. I have been loathe to do so, mostly because in Devon, 3ft-thick walls do not prevent damp. We built our house and I remember the architect being very hot with the builders about pug being knocked off the wall ties. I have no damp problems, our windows are mahogony and in perfect condition after 20 yrs. At the time of building, we installed double insultaion in the loft. My heating bills seem fair-good when comparing my house with others. Having spent 10 minutes reading this website, I'm NOT going to have it installed and hopefully all discussions can cease! Very many thanks to you all.
Jane C
PS - Solar panels being installed next month - we are doing our bit!
Hi Didz
I hope the action taken cures your problem, but the theory seems a bit dubious. The effect of the insulation is to prevent heat from moving from inside the house to the outer skin of the cavity. Therefore, where the insulation is missing I would expect the outer skin to be warmer due to umimpeded radiation from within the house and therefore less likely to attract condensation.
Anyway the best of luck and I'm sure you will get it sorted out soon.
i am an inspector for a cwi company,and all comments on here are right and wrong!some houses are and are not suitable for cwi.and also its all down to the way you live.. eg, 60 years ago a bungalow was bult with single glazed windows,virgin loft and 9 x 6 vents in every room.cold house!fast forward 60 years and... all vents sealed over with plaster and wallpaper.upvc double glazing with no trickle vents! 300mm insulation in loft and cwi,lady lives all year round with no windows open,house sweats to death! mould everywhere! inc pic frames!!so many arguments for and against this,i could go all night telling stories about this,but at the end of the day like anything theres a risk!? a good company will recognise if your house is suitable for cwi or not?but beware with the goverment throwing millions of grants at the green issue,everyone is out to make money regardless of the consequences for the sake of a quick buck!...it pains me! i'm chasing my tale constantley trying to train teams and surveyors to sign up and install suitable propertys!unfortunatley i'm on a loser most of the time,and this can be said for all!!! insulation companies
i recently applied to have cwi, house inspected then they started work only to stop after having done one wall - reason being that the cavity on the remaining two wall isn't wide enough.
aside from the fact that the inspector should have spotted this, i can understand the problem with the use of flock, as it will not flow into the cavity as well as beads. i asked to have beads used for the remaining two walls, but was told that the cavity is too narrow for beads also. i have a suspition this may be a load of waffle as th ebloke who did the work said they no longer had the right equipment/machinery and i have had problems getting to even speak to the company. my question then is this a qenuine reason for not being able to fill with beads? (i have used beads for other things, so i know how well they flow!) my house is 1930's semi, on the cold side.
I remember a report, (30 years ago?),which looked into CWI and concluded that it was NOT recommended for properties in areas exposed to high winds and heavy rain (like Pembrokeshire for instance). All materials used seemed to have possible problems as previously mentioned for polystyrene beads attacking PVC and falling out of holes .Rockwool has been known to be colonised by ants as I guess glassfibre could be too and polyurethane foam as originally used sometimes gave rise to unhealthy fumes while setting and cracking leading to tracking due to movement in the cavity leaves. Perhaps it would be better to leave the cavity alone and insulate the interior wall surface.
I Have not seen any comments about the corrosion and failure of wall ties due to water on the inside of the outer skin of brickwork, which over the years can occur, especially with the galvanised wire "Butterfly" ties. The two walls are then no longer tied together across the cavity & expensive cutting out & refixing is essential to stop the walls bulging or cracking.
i was approached by a company a couple of days ago & said that they could do it for free as my wife receives certain benefits, the lad said he would leave further info through my door and gave me his mobile number scrawled on a scrap of paper. still waiting fo his 'info' but i sense that i have found the answers right here.i WON'T be having it done ,instead ,as i get round to redecorating ,i'll look into internal insulation..
p.s. my neighbours had their walls done last year and the cowboys siliconed the airbricks up!
The thermal conductivity of air is similar to the thermal conductivity of the material used to fill wall cavities, so the reduction in heat loss is not significant, and certainly not worth the risk of problems with damp. Insulate the loft to a depth of 200mm and forget about the wall cavity.
I commented a few weeks ago and have been very interested to receive comments as they are posted by email. Am still NOT going to have it done, although my father hasn't given up trying to persuade me, even after I forwarded a comment about having an ant problem caused by rockwool cwi: he has an ant problem but has not confirmed whether it was post-cwi....
I suppose you could argue that this website is geared towards the antis, but I feel we should think of it as being geared towards the sensible people who consider everything very carefully and are rather wary of promoters' claims!
I worked in the cavity wall industry for a number of years and have seen many many horror stories caused by the failure of cavity wall insualtion.So much so that we developed a technique for extracting the stuff from the wall and, started a company specialising in act